By TAYLOR PENSONEAU
The Illinois political correspondent of the St. Louis Post-Dispatch, he has covered Illinois government for 10 years. A native of Belleville, Pensoneau is a 1962 graduate of the University of Missouri School of Journalism.

Dave O' Neal Who is he? A Republican who wins in Democratic St. Clair County and is running for lieutenant governor. He tells how he'll work with Jim Thompson if the GOP wins the governor's chair in November THE LIFE of Belleville's Dave O' Neal, the Republican candidate for lieutenant governor in the November election, has been one of very sharp changes of direction. Many persons felt that O'Neal bit off far more than he could chew when he jumped headlong into politics in 1970 by seeking election to the sheriffs office of St. Clair County as a Republican. The county was then, and still is, a Democratic stronghold. But when O'Neal beat Democrat Clifford Flood, it made him a luminary overnight in the rough, tumble and sometimes corrupt jungle of politics that dominates the heavily populated section of Illinois across the Mississippi River from St. Louis.

When O'Neal sought reelection to the post two years ago, the Democrats tried to defeat him with Joseph Rodriguez, one of the most respected law enforcement officers in the county. O'Neal survived.

As a result of these election successes, many observers predicted that O' Neal would not find the going any tougher when he set his sights this year on election to the state's second highest office. He handily defeated Mrs. Joan G. Anderson of Western Springs in a contest for his party's nomination for lieutenant governor in the March primary election.

The team of James R. Thompson, the Republican candidate for governor, and O'Neal has fared well in preballoting polls. As O'Neal pointed out in an interview, "This is the first race I've ever been in ... where I've been in the lead, according to the polls . .. ."

The situation understandably has spurred interest in the background of the 39-year-old O'Neal, who is far from well known outside Southern Illinois. He is a virtual stranger, as is Thompson, to the state governmental world of Springfield.

In the event O'Neal takes office as the state's next lieutenant governor in January, Belleville might be in line for special recognition. Although statewide offices almost have become a preserve of Chicago area residents, Illinois Treasurer Alan J. Dixon, the Democratic candidate for secretary of state, also is from Belleville.

O'Neal, born in Belleville January 24, 1937, was reared on the west side of a town known for preservation of its German heritage and for the cleanliness of its old neighborhoods. O'Neal's father, Floyd C. O'Neal, who died two days after the March 16 primary, had been a miner, painter and an insurance salesman. O'Neal recalled that his father moved to Belleville from Cutler, Ill., during the Depression "to take a job, I believe, painting the [county] court-house in the city. He stayed in the town."

After graduation in 1955 from Belleville Township High School, where he was a basketball standout, O'Neal accepted an athletic scholarship to McKendree. "I was thinking of becoming a Methodist minister," O'Neal said. "My family had always been quite religious. I had an awful lot of cousins and relatives who were clergy, or were studying for the clergy." But, after two years at McKendree, a period during which he studied theology with time out for basketball, baseball and tennis, O'Neal enlisted in the Marines.

When asked for a reason, he replied that "in looking back, I remember having some bad associations with members of the clergy I became acquainted with through McKendree, and I tended to blame the church. I was, in reality, a 19-year-old that didn't have it together. I was confused. I didn't know what to do. So, I went into the Marine Corps, hoping to settle down and maybe decide something about the future."

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After returning to Belleville from the Marines, O'Neal's life entered another new phase with his graduation in 1962 from a pharmacy college in St. Louis. From that point until he became sheriff, he operated the Westown drug store in Belleville. The pharmacy was not his only business interest. He was a founder of My School, a preschool facility in Belleville for three, four and five-year- old children. He said that My School is owned by the B and D Land Corp., a firm in which O'Neal, his brother Robert and a Belleville surgeon are the stockholders.

O'Neal and his brother also are two of the three partners in Walto Associates of Belleville, an enterprise which owns, O'Neal said, about 13 buildings containing rental units. "I believe all of the buildings are in Belleville," O'Neal said, "but don't hold me to too many details about the business because I really don't have much to do with it."

In his race for sheriff six years ago, O'Neal depicted his effort as a move by a concerned individual to leave private life in order to bring respectability to an office long under the heel of the county's Democratic machine.

His campaign, observers recall, was one of the most energetic by a GOP candidate for a St. Clair office in many years. O'Neal refused to write off any areas, including the Democratic bastion of East St. Louis, the county's largest city. Saying that "everybody told me that I couldn't get votes in East St. Louis," O'Neal added that "I got about 32 per cent of the tally there, compared to the roughly 18 per cent that a Republican frequently received."

One change in the office under O'Neal was the implementation of a merit employment system for road deputies and county jail correctional officers. Process servers, bailiffs and office personnel still are patronage employees.

"I promised in the campaign to do something about the pure spoils system in the office, a reason for the lack of performance," O'Neal said. "When I took over, personnel files did not even exist. Things are different now."

O'Neal is married to the former Sandra Finley of Mascoutah. Mrs. O'Neal, a karate instructor at the YMCA in Belleville, has a master's degree in cell biology from Southern Illinois University at Edwardsville. She is now seeking a doctorate in pathology at St. Louis University. The O'Neals have two daughters, Allison, 15, and Kelly, 13. The family lives at the county jail in Belleville.

The following interview, which focuses largely on O'Neal's view of the office that he is seeking, was conducted September 2 in Springfield.

Q: What prompted your bid for the lieutenant governorship?
A: Besides wanting the office, I think it should be pointed out that in 1972, when Gov. [Richard B.] Ogilvie was going to run for reelection, he talked to me, as he did to four or five other people, and said that he was considering me for lieutenant governor. He wanted me to talk to some county chairmen, which I did for about four months, so that it would not have been a surprise to the party people if he had picked me.

Q: What is the basic theme that you are emphasizing in attempting to sell yourself to the electorate of Illinois?
A: I am stressing the contrast that I offer to the sorry state of the lieutenant governor's office in recent years. In looking at the chaos of Illinois government under the current administration, one cannot ignore the fact that the lieutenant governor, because of his political ambition and his orders from the fifth floor of Chicago's city hall, has not cooperated with the present governor. Be it the current governor's fault, or the lieutenant governor's, and I think it's a combination of both, they never did get together.

To me, there's a lack of knowledge on the job of lieutenant governor by the current lieutenant governor. Although I understand that he's a personable chap, I think his insights into government are poor because the lieutenant governor is only as viable as the governor permits. As soon as you allow your ambition to be a threat to the governor, you can't be a viable lieutenant governor.

That's why it was so important that I sit down with both of the persons seeking the Republican nomination for governor before I announced to make sure that I could agree with either Jim Thompson or Dick Cooper, that we both had the same philosophy of government.

Disagreement on some issues is understandable. However, if Thompson assigns me a job as lieutenant governor, say to present him a program, I'm going to fulfill the request in private. I'll let him present the program, and then help him lobby the legislators to see that it gets through. If he asks me to prepare a program, and I do so and then run to the media and leave him out, he's not going to assign me too many more important tasks.

So, were I in [Lt. Gov.] Neil Hartigan's position during these last four years, I would have had to resign.

Q: What is your reaction to polls which have shown the ticket of Thompson and O'Neal running strongly?
A: I am not a firm believer in polls. I am a believer in the polling place. I was not supposed to win in 1970 or 1974, and I was not supposed to win the primary of 1976. But I have a habit of winning elections. I am not a good sport. I do not like second place. So, I work as hard as I possibly can. If I should ever be defeated, let it be because I succumbed to a superior opponent, not because I didn't work.

Q: Some persons believe that you are very fortunate, politically speaking, to be running with an apparently formidable candidate such as Thompson. These individuals do not believe that you are known well enough to win election to state office on your own. What is your comment?
A: I am certainly not a household word. In the primary, naturally, I was going for Republican votes, so I think people in the party know me. But, the campaign for lieutenant governor is a low profile one — it just doesn't have the issues that the campaign for governor does. A member of the press made the statement the other day that if I were running directly against the current lieutenant governor, he would be beating me three to one. That's quite possible because of his name exposure but if I was running against him one on one, I wouldn't be running the kind of campaign I am now.

Q: What do you believe to be your major contribution or role in regard to the Thompson-O'Neal ticket and the campaign?
A: Polls have shown that Thompson's weakest part of the state, for him, was the southern part. He's had less name exposure there, not like in the northern part where he's been a newsmaker for five years. But, I do have pretty good name recognition in the south, particularly in the heavily populated region of St. Clair and Madison counties.

Thus, I'm concentrating in the campaign on Southern Illinois. In fact, I'm

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'Neither Jim Thompson nor Dave O'Neal have any enemies in the legislature . . . After two years, we'll probably have made some'

spending 80 per cent of my campaign time south of Springfield. I've been campaigning for a year and a half, quietly I'll admit, but I have been campaigning.

I want to add that our campaign is really a team effort. It is totally coordinated.

Q: Have you had any association with state government?
A: I was a member of the Illinois Law Enforcement Commission for two years. I was appointed by Ogilvie.

Q: Your critics say that your lack of extensive involvement with state government makes you less than qualified to be lieutenant governor. What is your answer to this?
A: I view this as an asset. For instance, we've seen confrontation politics for the last four years in Springfield, great anxieties between the legislature and the executive branch.

Neither Jim Thompson nor Dave O'Neal have any enemies in the legislative branch that I know of. After two years, we'll probably have made some, but now it's an open ball game. I think most legislators will be receptive when they see we're competent and mean business.

In terms of the experience argument, I think it should be pointed out that I have government background at the county level. I am also aware of municipal problems, township ones. I think the future strength of the country depends on the strength of local governments . . . and lesser federal involvement and lesser state involvement, for that matter.

Local governments need a far greater voice in Springfield. Too many times, legislators pass laws putting more responsibility on the shoulders of local governments, but then provide no extra money. Many local governments are just in a bind.

Q: Democrats contend that you and Thompson may turn off some voters with your frequent criticism of Democratic Mayor Richard Daley of Chicago. The Democrats argue that downstate attacks on Daley are nothing more than an overworked Republican campaign gimmick. Are they right?
A: Regardless of what they say, few people in Illinois want state government run by the fifth floor in the city hall of Chicago. The Democratic candidates for governor and lieutenant governor are both Chicagoans, and they both answer to Daley, meaning that their election will permit his kind of bossism in Springfield.

At no time have Thompson and O'Neal made any statement about the ability of Daley to run the city of Chicago. As compared to other major cities, his record might look pretty good. We have no ax to grind with the mayor, no problems with him that I know of. But, I don't think he should run state government.

Q: How has fund-raising gone this year?
A: In the primary, I raised money on my own. I think we raised about $43,000 or $44,000 for that effort, which isn't very much for a state primary race. Most of my primary contributions came from St. Clair County. When I ran for sheriff, we would not accept a contribution in either campaign of over $500. I didn't see why anyone would want to donate more than that to a race for sheriff. In the lieutenant governor primary contest, I would not accept any donation over $1,000. As for the campaign now, my fund-raising is completely coordinated with Thompson's effort. Whatever money comes in through me goes to the Thompson-O'Neal committee or campaign. My expenses are financed by the joint campaign.

Q: What would you do as lieutenant governor?
A: Jim wants me to be his liaison between the executive and legislative branches. Second, he wants me to be his troubleshooter throughout the state. I will move about in this regard at his direction. Third, he wants me to be his emissary. This means that I will speak for him or represent him at various events. Fourth, he wants me as lieutenant governor to be a member of his cabinet, to be part of the policy-making process. He wants feedback from my office.

Q: Does this mean that you might serve as a devil's advocate in respect to Thompson?
A: I certainly hope so. But, I am not going to go out and embarrass the governor. As governor, Thompson will have the final say in the administration. The lieutenant governor should understand that. I may disagree on a matter, and I may argue with him in private like crazy. But, the final decision is his, and once he makes it, I'll back him.

Q: As lieutenant governor, would you continue the role of so-called ombudsman that has developed in the office in recent years?
A: Oh, the office may continue doing something like that, but I am not really sure what Thompson's feeling is on it.

I think the first thing is that we have to reorganize the executive branch, which Jim has talked about all during the campaign, and stop the continued growth of all these bureaus and commissions and departments and other agencies, one on top of the other.

One hundred ombudsmen couldn't straighten out a problem for a citizen with all this red tape. So, the first thing to do, for example, would be to have it so that senior citizens would only have to go with their problems to one or two agencies instead of having to deal with some 16 as at present.

Q: What is your reply to criticism that a ticket of Thompson, a former prosecutor, and O'Neal, a sheriff, represents an overemphasis on law enforcement?
A: I don't think it is an issue. If it would be, then it's an asset, not a detriment. Law enforcement is one of Thompson's priority areas on spending.

The criminal justice system is not functioning properly in Illinois. That also needs to be overhauled. We intend to do that. So, his knowledge of prosecution and the courts and my practical knowledge of on-the-street law enforcement will be an asset in knowing exactly where we're going in this regard.

The next question usually touches on our concern for individual rights, and I'd like to touch on this right away. Jim Thompson is the kind of constitutional lawyer that puts' personal rights above everything else.

I'm the sheriff that turned a segregated jail into an integrated jail. I'm not aware that any charges or cases have ever gotten off the ground where we've been accused of brutality or violating the rights of a person. 

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